King Charles might still allow That Urn to be examined….!

The mystery of who/what is in That Urn* in Westminster Abbey has been rattling around for centuries, and now it’s in the news again. Westminster Abbey is what is known as a Royal Peculiar, and therefore under the jurisdiction of the monarch. See here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_peculiar. While the late Queen wouldn’t allow the urn to be examined, it seems that her son, King Charles III, who studied archaeology at Cambridge, has a different attitude. I wrote about this back in 2020, when it first surfaced that Charles’s thoughts on the urn differed from those of his mother (see here https://murreyandblue.org/2020/11/14/prince-charles-poised-to-solve-550-year-old-royal-mystery-on-throne/) but now it’s in the headlines again. I don’t know if there has been some new development.

“….Chief curator of Historic Royal Palaces, Tracy Borman, explained: ‘He [King Charles] has said he would like an investigation to go ahead, so that we can determine, once and for all, how the young royals died.’….” Always the sly twist! No, Ms Borman, it’s not to find out how the young royals died, it’s to find out if the bones in the urn could possibly be those of the princes or, more likely, of a much earlier period. Probably Roman. With a few animal bones thrown in, quite literally.

Ms Borman is a Tudor historian and is never likely to give Richard III a fair hearing. See https://murreyandblue.org/2024/08/27/more-tv-delving-into-what-happened-to-the-boys-in-the-tower/. Another such committed Tudorite is Lucy Worsley, who only seems happy when she’s prancing around in 16th century clothes. See https://murreyandblue.org/2022/06/12/lucy-worsley-proves-richard-iii-murdered-his-nephews/. As soon as these ladies’ names are trotted out, we know the slant of the programme/book/whatever will be anti-Richard.

According to the latest article to arrive in my mailbox (https://uk.style.yahoo.com/king-charles-supportive-solving-spooky-082245340.html) the history of the urn is that the remains of two children (it’s not known whether they were male or female) were found under a staircase in the Tower in 1674. Because the box also contained “rags of velvet” and matched the location described by that oracle of all oracles, Thomas More. He said they were interred in a handsome urn, labelled as the remains of the sons of Edward IV, and that’s how it’s been ever since.

Well hallelujah. If the Sainted Sir Thomas claimed the bones were those of the princes, then it HAS to be so! I mean, he was a witness to the dastardly deeds, wasn’t he? Aged four, or whatever. A remarkably precocious little chap. 🙄

The presence of velvet proves nothing because the fabric has been around since at least the time of the Ancient Egyptians, see here https://trc-leiden.nl/trc-digital-exhibition/index.php/velvet/item/173-a-brief-history-of-velvet. And it wasn’t only used by the nephews of Richard III! For heaven’s sake, when is this stupid kowtowing to Tudor lies going to end?

Anyway, once again we have to wait to see if anything new ensues. But I’m afraid that I don’t hold out much hope concerning the end result. For Richard to be innocent simply will not SUIT too many vested interests!

* An excellent account of the urn and its contents can be found here https://murreyandblue.org/2014/11/17/another-view/ by the late Super Blue.


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  1. I dearly hope the investigation ends up in the right, competent, and honest hands.

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  2. I read that the “authorities” don’t want to discover that the bones are not the sons of Edward IV because there are other burials there that are not who they are thought to be. Richard II was an example. What is the evidence that Richard II is not in Westminster Abbey?

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    1. Thank you, David. I hadn’t heard that there was doubt about Richard II being in Westminster Abbey. I know all about the False Richard, of course, but always believed it really was him in the tomb. Now I doubt. There’s always been a question mark over Edward II at Gloucester Cathedral, i.e. when and where he really died) and I find THAT story fascinating. I wrote about it here https://murreyandblue.org/2024/03/06/a-circumstantial-but-viable-clue-to-the-eventual-death-of-edward-ii/. But Richard II is a new one to me….

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  3. Christine Kutlar-kreutz Avatar
    Christine Kutlar-kreutz

    Morus schreibt: ” …wurden nackt mit ihrem Bettzeug am Fuße einer Treppe bequem und sehr tief unter einem Haufen begraben….” Wo kommt dann auf einmal der blaue Samt her? Außerdem wären sie nachts im Schlaf erstickt worden, ob sie Nachthemden aus blauem Samt getragen haben, glaube ich eher nicht. Der blaue Samt wird bei Croyland erwähnt, als Edward und der Herzog von Gloucester nach London gekommen sind. Ich kenne auch die gekritzelte Frage an der Seite des Protokolls von Lawrence Tanner: “blauer Samt?” Da wurde aus einer Frage ganz einfach eine Behauptung gemacht! Fehlen nur noch die Backenzähne….😂

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    1. Ich stimme herzlich zu! (Es tut mir leid, dass mein Deutscher ein bisschen rostig ist.)

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      1. Christine Kutlar-kreutz Avatar
        Christine Kutlar-kreutz

        vielen Dank für deine Antwort und dein Deutsch ist einwandfrei, was man von meinem Englisch nicht behaupten kann. Murray and Blue folge ich seit vielen Jahren und alles was ich über Richard III weiß, habe ich zuerst hier gelernt und dann weiter recherchiert, weil mir die Berichte schon immer unglaubwürdig vorgekommen sind. Das liegt hauptsächlich an Shakespeare und daran weil ich weiß wie Reiten funktioniert und Pferde “ticken”. Da müsste Richard auf dem Schlachtfeld ein dritter Arm gewachsen sein…😂😂😂

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  4. Christine: Mein Deutsch war früher ganz passabel, weil ich 1962 bei den Mielewerke in Gütersloh, Westfalen, (Exportabteilung, Niederlande) gearbeitet habe. Aber das ist lange her, und jetzt brauche ich Google Translate, um sicherzugehen, dass ich so richtig wie möglich spreche. Ich habe Deutschland geliebt und deutsche Freunde gefunden. Sie haben Recht, dass Richard in Bosworth einen dritten Arm braucht. Ich mache mir im Blog gern über die Tudors lustig! Alles Gute, Sandra (viscountessw).

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