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Evidence, please?

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From John-Ashdown-Hill, whose Private Life of Edward IV is published a month today:

“Can anyone find ANY CONTEMPORARY EVIDENCE to show that Edmund, Earl of Richmond, Jasper, Earl of Pembroke, or Henry VII ever used the name TUDOR?

That surname definitely was used by Owen.
For example, in 1459 Henry VI gave a commission to ‘Owin Tuder’ (CPR, 1452-1461, p. 494).

But although the indexes of the published versions of the CPR, CCR, &c, list Edmund, Jasper and Henry under that surname, I haven’t yet found one single entry which actually employs it.

SO IF YOU CAN FIND ANY EVIDENCE, PLEASE LET ME KNOW!”

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  1. David Avatar
    David

    Richard III’s proclamation against the rebels, 1485. Although this is hardly them referring to themselves. It is Richard recounting their ancestry.

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    1. super blue Avatar
      super blue

      Just trying to find a name for him?

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  2. halfwit36 Avatar
    halfwit36

    I believe that when Henry had to use a last name, as on his application for a dispensation to marry, he signed himself ‘Henry (de) Richmond.’ Presumably,Jasper would have been Jasper Pembroke. Owen, not having been ennobled, would have been ‘Owen Tudor,’ and that name was used by other members of the family, such as the son who became a monk.

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    1. timetravellingbunny Avatar
      timetravellingbunny

      This seems to have been standard at the time – nobles didn’t use what we see as their “family names” nearly as much as we tend to. For instance, Anne Neville’s signature was “Anne Warwick”.

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  3. THE WHITE LYON & THE MOURNING SWORD | murreyandblue

    […] There is also another Wars of the Roses connection in Hereford that few seem to know about. In the Town Hall is a fine collection of plate, Town Charters dating back into the Middle Ages sealed by Richard Lionheart and Henry III, and ceremonial swords and maces. One of these is the ‘Mourning Sword’ (You’ll note that Gloucester also has a ‘Mourning Sword’ presented by Richard III). This was given to the city by Henry VIII and was supposed to have been the battle-dented, broken sword of his “great-grandfather” Owen Tudor. […]

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  4. Thomas More and the Removal Men | murreyandblue

    […] that much knew and little cause had to lie’, with the assertion that Tyrell and Dighton had confessed to the crime when they were questioned in the Tower prior to Tyrell’s trial and execution in 1502 […]

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  5. The Tudors were a “typically Welsh family”….! | murreyandblue

    […] her and so she turned to the convenient Owen Tudor instead. And there doesn’t appear to be any proof that she and Owen really did […]

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  6. Henry VII had an uncle Owen Tudor . . . . | murreyandblue

    […] It suggests that Katherine and Owen had at least six children, with three surviving sons that we know of. The two eldest were Edmund (father of Henry VII) and Jasper, but there was a third, Owen (born 1432/1433), who seems to disappear. Surely he was the Owen Tudor, monk of Westminster? It has to be him, if he’s commemorated as the uncle of Henry VII. Doesn’t he? And perhaps he would “disappear” if he became a monk at Westminster. […]

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